97. Finite Games vs. Infinite Games. Why you can’t and shouldn’t “win” everywhere.

Hi everyone and welcome to Project Mindset, the channel for all those who know that with the right mindset, anything is possible. Before I get to today’s podcast topic, I have a little story to tell. I recently met up with Frank Krüger again. He’s the YouTuber I had on my podcast a while back. That was episode number 33. We had a really interesting conversation. Basically, we talked about his life story, how he started out as a teacher and then made the switch to becoming a YouTuber.

He has a DIY channel. Feel free to check it out. Like I said, it’s episode number 33. And back then we talked a lot about family, about the whole mindset thing. I’d say it’s about making an uncertain decision from a position of security and actually going through with it. So, the switch from being a teacher, essentially a civil servant—what I’d say is probably the most secure job in the world, teaching in Germany—to becoming a YouTuber. Probably one of the most uncertain jobs there is.

And back then, we talked a lot about this topic, but also about family. Family is hugely important to him. He said that almost everything he does is aimed at creating the life he wants for his wife and children. And now, since we met recently, we gave each other some updates.

Consciously reducing one’s workload

He told me that making YouTube videos as a content creator put him under a lot of stress. He constantly had to produce new videos and other content. And that he’s now slowing down a bit, or rather, putting on the handbrake, so he doesn’t lose his creativity. And in that context, he said something very interesting, which is what I’m getting at.

He said that in many areas of life you can put on the handbrake, but he will never do it in the family sphere, meaning, for example, when it comes to his kids or time with his wife, he will never put on the handbrake there, but he has no problem saying that he is now doing a little less, for example, in his job as a YouTuber, as a creator, and will probably earn a little less as well, but he will never do it in his private life.

I found that super interesting, I definitely took note, and I wanted to share it with you briefly before I start today’s podcast. Maybe it will get you thinking, like it did me. Great, today’s podcast episode is actually about the following. I’ve called it Finite Games versus Infinite Games, meaning finite games versus infinite games. What I mean by that is, we’re all familiar with finite games. These are things that have a starting point and therefore an end point.

What makes a game finite

This could be a completely normal football match, a basketball match, so in the realm of sports, for example, there is a start and an end, there is a winner, there are rules and so on and so forth that one can follow, and in the end, after a certain time, the game is over and someone has won or someone has lost..

Applied to other areas, even our education, whether it’s high school graduation, university studies, or whatever, has a start somewhere, and you work towards a certain end to achieve a certain result, and then it’s over. This permeates pretty much, I would say, most areas of life, such as sports, education, and so on, projects that you’re trying to complete, or events that you’re planning. It’s also reflected in our mindset: I’ll work until retirement, and then work is over. So here too, people want to do something for 40 years before they have to stop working.

In these finite games, it looks like this: there’s a final point, and after that, it doesn’t continue. It’s a finite game, and I think many of us have internalized that concept too much, because we’re now applying it to many other areas as well.

Infinite games have no fixed end point.

There are also Infinite Games, meaning games that last forever. In these, there is no winner or loser, no end time. Of course, realistically, there is an end time for our lives, but if you observe the course of life, there is no game, so to speak, or point in time where you can say, for example, about health, “I’ve won the health game,” or relationships are another very good example: “I’ve won the relationship game.”

Infinite Games is basically about staying in the game as long as possible, so to speak. If I relate this to the topic of health, I can of course say, “I want to lose 10 kilograms in the next six months, get physically fit, and also pay attention to my diet, and so on and so forth.”

But what happens after the six months, when I’ve reached my goal? Have I won then? Maybe I’ve won this short sprint, but after that I actually have to keep going, because otherwise I’ll fall back again, and in the end, a yo-yo effect might be much worse than, for example, staying consistently at a relatively high level, i.e., weight level.

Why a goal doesn’t have to be the end

Yo-yo dieting can also be unhealthy. That’s the point with these “infinite games,” like the ones you have in your health, for example. It makes no sense to work towards a goal and then say, “That’s it, I’ve won, I’ve achieved it, and now I’m not doing anything anymore.” A good example is the realm of relationships in life—partnerships, marriages, and so on. There’s no real winning or losing there. So, if I have a discussion with my partner, and I try to reach a conclusion where I “win” the argument, thinking I was right and my partner was wrong, and therefore I’ve won, that’s fundamentally pointless because there is no winning or losing.

It’s a never-ending game. The whole point of a relationship is to continue it. That means, when I think about topics like relationships, I have to make decisions and act in a way that, even during arguments, doesn’t lead to a breakup, or to making it impossible to look each other in the eye, or leaving me as the winner and the other person as the loser. Ideally, you want to stay in the relationship; that’s why it doesn’t make any sense.

Continued

That means you have to consider it an infinite game. And our problem, I think for many people today, is that we transfer the mindset of a finite game to an infinite game. This happens in many situations. I sometimes catch myself doing this, even with good friends, for example. I very rarely argue with good friends, but I sometimes catch myself thinking, “Ah, now I really want to be right.” Yes, in the end I might be right about the content, but if the relationship with a friend suffers because, for example, we’ve had an argument of some kind, then it just doesn’t make any sense.

That means you can act and speak in such a way that after a discussion, things can continue normally. This relationship, this friendship, the romantic relationship, or whatever it may be. And that’s the point: not always trying to put an end to something. Especially with topics like health and relationships, it makes no sense to be in a finite mindset; you need to be in an infinite mindset instead. For example, when it comes to exercise, I don’t completely exhaust myself and then do nothing for two days or two weeks. Instead, it’s about doing a little something every day, eating healthily every day.

Staying in the game long-term

Sure, there are occasional exceptions. You can eat unhealthily now and then, or take a few days off. But basically, it’s about approaching the sport as if you’re going to do it indefinitely, not saying, “Okay, I’ll do a sprint for six months and then it’s all over.” Instead, you train in a way that allows you to sustain the long term, because there are no winners in this case. The point is simply to stick with it.

This applies to many areas of life, where there might be an end, a start, or a conclusion. So I believe even in the professional world, you can act in such a way that you say, okay, I work every day, for example, but I work in such a way that there’s no end in sight, because then you’re just working towards a goal, and when the goal is reached, you’ve lost sight of the purpose behind it. I work in such a way that I learn something new every day. I work in such a way that it becomes an endless game for me, and I simply never lose the enjoyment of it.

Applying the concept to one’s own life

I’d heard this concept on another podcast before. I adapted it a bit to my own life situation, where I think it makes the most sense for me, but I found it incredibly interesting to understand. Because I’m naturally wired to want to win and so on, but that doesn’t make sense in every area. I’ve also had phases in my life where I was maybe a bit lazier, did a little less exercise, and then told myself, okay, I’ll stick with it for three months and then I can ease up a bit.

But that’s not the point. If I think that way in all areas of life, that I first go on a sprint and then somehow take it easy, chill out, and so on, that makes no sense at all. It’s better to consistently try to do something regularly. You’re not trying to show your partner, “Yes, I won this argument,” but rather working on perhaps bringing the relationship to a different level where you can have more normal discussions with each other.

Continuing relationships together

That’s so much more productive, it contributes so much more to this Infinite Games mindset, instead of saying, okay, every discussion is worth fighting over. I have to win, I have to show the other person how great I am, that I always make the right decisions, and so on. That doesn’t make any sense to me anymore. I think we should be aware of which games in life are finite and which are practically infinite, and then act accordingly. Great, everyone, that’s all for today’s podcast episode.

I hope you were able to take something away from this. If so, I would be very grateful if you could talk about it with your friends and family, and if you could leave me a like or a review, because that’s the only way Project Mindset can continue to grow. We’ll talk again soon, and until then, don’t forget, mindset is everything.